Is @JimmyTheGiant RIGHT About Andrew Tate? (POS)

Antony Jones (Apr 13, 2025 7:00am | Duration: 0h 22m 23s)

Summary	Transcription	Comments
andrew tate (6) young men (5) young lads (4) jimmy (3) giant (3) thatcher (3) young lad (3) ca n't (3) well (3) capitalist realism (2) young person (2) men 's issues (2) young guys (2) gender expectations (2) mental health (2) n't talk (2) computer games (2) long way (2) young man (2) valid emotion (2) young boys (2) bad thing (2) alpha male (2) trump (2) donald trump (2)	Today I want to go over an interview with Jimmy the Giant on the Troll Podcast.     Go and check them both out.     Where he talks about the appeal of Andrew Tate for young men in a capitalist system.     Where we're told constantly our value is related to the stuff we own, the money we have.     And women are attracted to wealth, power and prestige.     So let's get into the interview and break it down.     Yeah, but like that Thatcher attitude of there's no alternative.     Capitalism is everything and he won.     And so young lads are looking at him and they're like, well...     The thing about, this is where I've kind of landed.     And I guess it's from learning a bit more about, I guess, capitalism and stuff.     Is like Jordan Peterson and all the self-help people.     They exist in the framework of what people refer to as like capitalist realism.     Which is like the belief that the way that our society, the dog eat dog sort of competitive, hyper competitive world that we live in.     The belief that that is, they sell it like that is just fundamental human nature.     And so obviously that's where I deeply disagree.     But in the framework, in the world we live in, it is like that.     We are incredibly dog eat dog and life will not give you anything for free.     It's like, it's tough.     Within that world, self-help messages like pick yourself up by the bootstraps.     No one's going to give a fuck about you.     You need to become a man.     It's true in that framework.     Like literally, you do need to do those things.     And so that message when you're young and like you haven't learned about all these structures and why it's like this.     And actually there might be alternatives to this.     Within that premise and a young person is looking at their life and like looking ahead and they're like, well, I can see what the average salary is.     I can see how many years of uni I'm going to have to do.     I can see how expensive a house is.     I have no fucking choice but to buy into that.     And also interestingly, they've done polling on this where I think one in six teenage boys are kind of attracted to Andrew Tate's message.     But most of it, half of it is more to do with the self-help stuff.     So yeah, people buy into the misogyny.     People do buy into it.     And you kind of got to look at it as a whole package.     Yes, you can separate it for some, maybe 50-50.     But there is that need.     And self-help over the last, well, at least 100 years, if not 200 years, has been a very popular genre of you've got to do it by yourself.     And over the last 40 years, the idea that no one's going to help you.     You've got to work hard.     You've got to hustle.     You've got to start Bitcoin.     You've got to start hustling your side hustle, selling stuff.     There's a grain of truth to it.     And with any ideology, anything that's popular, there will be a grain of truth to it.     And Jimmy the Giant's right.     Under capitalist realism, the idea that there is no alternative.     This is it.     The end of history.     We can do no better.     It's deeply depressing.     But what alternatives are there?     There's a Keynesian alternative.     We tax the rich.     We build infrastructure.     We invest in our country.     But that's not popular at the moment.     So it's a deeply depressing situation where Andrew Tate's are popular.     Because although I would question that to an extent, there was a peak Andrew Tate a few years ago, 2018 or so.     But I think a lot of people on the right are distancing themselves from him because of his allegations, his toxicity.     They don't want to be associated with that.     But he's still as popular.     He's like, he's an edgelord.     He's making jokes, racist jokes on Twitter.     He's being provocative.     And that's appealing to young men.     And I understand it.     But at the same time, the left has failed here because we can't talk about these issues because they are complex and nuanced.     And often men's issues right now don't lend to a nuanced debate.     If I work really hard, I can make something of myself.     And it's like, it's a sad thing of literally he is right within the framework of the world we're in currently.     And obviously our argument is that framework is fucked and it shouldn't be like that.     I agree, by the way, the framework is fucked.     And I really feel for the younger generations.     What I struggle with a bit, or maybe not, but I want to ask you this question.     Why is it mostly men and young men?     Yeah, that's where I think it was manipulative.     And so that's where I think when we were young guys, young guys, we didn't see why that could be considered a little bit like maybe misogynistic or something like that.     Just from the frame of women have the exact same thing.     Problems.     Yeah, but I think when you're a young lad and he's telling you, it's like, it's you, it's you, it's you.     Or it's like, you know, he's looking at certain, he'll show certain data that might show, I don't know, women might get better education results.     But then he may be a bit quiet about the data about, I don't know, when women start asking for more money, they're more likely to be penalized by asking for more money.     When men are more likely to be rewarded for it.     He'll be quiet about that side of data.     And he'll be like, look, women, you know, feminism has done a very good job so far.     And actually now it seems like women are actually doing better.     But it's like really misrepresenting the data.     So because maybe as a young person.     Yeah.     I think I spoke about this in a previous video.     You constantly hear this talking point.     And it's, it's manipulative and it's clever in a way because you're going, oh yeah, it's women.     Women have got too many rights now.     It's gone too far.     And a lot of young people believe that without looking at the complexity of how women still are victims of domestic violence.     Three to four women are killed a week by a partner or ex-partner in the UK.     But you've got to balance that with the fact that men unalive themselves at a similar rate.     And we need to look at that.     Why do men do that?     Why are men violent towards themselves and women?     And we need to have that serious conversation.     Are we having it?     In some quarters, yeah, academic quarters, they, they will talk about this.     And a lot of it, there is, there is a study that talks about how inequality and that need to be wealthy, to be a man of status, of owning a business, whatever, being a hustler, relates to feelings of insecurity, shame, that you don't meet that.     Because statistically, you're very unlikely to have a successful business.     Because I think, how many businesses fail within the first three years?     Like 80, 90%.     Because it's hard.     It's not easy.     People assume, oh, start a business.     It's going to be fine.     No.     Most businesses don't make money in the first few years.     And if you've got that financial backing, where you can take that hit and not make a profit for a few years, great.     Most people don't have that.     Most men don't have that.     So you're being told that your success and validity and essence is in your financial success, your power, what you own, while statistically being unable to meet those lofty heights.     And people wonder why men are depressed.     Any correlation, maybe?     Any person you're really like, you just focus on your life and what you're seeing.     And you're seeing that you have it fucked, all your mates have it fucked.     And then he's sort of manipulating some data to show that women actually have it a little bit better.     Then it's like, okay, yeah, maybe it is this sort of man thing.     Yeah.     What is really interesting is side by side, the male experience perhaps getting, well, getting worse because of the environment that we all live in in the system.     And I think that women outsource a lot of their therapy to their mates in a way.     And I speak as a parent of a boy and a girl that a lot of lads, not all, don't have that with their friendship circle.     Yeah, big time.     And when they're hanging out, they're sitting next to each other watching sport and they're sort of communing.     There's a really good clip actually from Jane Fonda.     Yeah.     And she talks about how when women get together, they actually, it's, they look at each other, they face each other, they talk to each other.     Yeah, their eyes.     And yet when men get together, they're actually, you're looking away, you're looking at sport, you're looking at women.     And we do a thing.     Yeah, exactly.     Play games, yeah, play on the whatever it is.     And in fact, you can, especially my husband, Ben, it'd be like, how are they, how is so-and-so?     What are they up to?     How are the kids?     What did you talk about?     Yeah.     I don't know.     This is where I like need to do a lot more research about how much is biology and how much is culture.     And I think it must overlap heavily.     But yeah, definitely young lads like.     I think it's so much culture.     There's maybe some biological elements, although that is contested by figures like Cordelia Vine.     She wrote a famous book.     I can't remember off the top of my head, but basically concluded that male and female brains, are pretty much exactly the same.     It's social expectations and gender expectations that create those differences in the brain.     So if women are expected to be more empathetic, emotional, the caregiver, the part of the brain responsible for that is it often grows.     Whereas if men are more likely expected to be logical, stoic, rational, the front part of the brain is going to be.     So I'm not saying there's not a biological component, but I think that often is overestimated compared to how just how throughout time just the expectations of men have shifted so much.     And different cultures and different perceptions of what it means to be a man.     None of it's inevitable.     Because if it was, if there was a universal man, it would never have changed.     10,000 years ago, 100,000 years ago, we'd be doing exactly the same thing now.     But we haven't.     We've built civilization.     We've built mental health talking groups for men.     Would we have had that 10?     Of course we wouldn't.     We wouldn't even have a concept of mental health.     We come up with that term.     Mental health is a human construct.     So I think these complicated discussions are hard to talk about because how do you evidence which comes first?     It's a chicken of eggs or egg situation.     But there's a lot of data that suggests actually, no, our environment is so powerful.     Like to do a thing.     They like to do sport together, but they don't talk together.     And we're all painfully aware of it.     And like, I remember I was talking to my missus, like I was talking about when I was younger.     I don't, you were kind of the one emotion.     I've heard other people say this.     And it's like the one emotion you're allowed to feel as a young lad is anger.     You're not allowed to cry and you're not allowed to feel sad and be like, you're not even allowed to feel a bit pathetic.     Like sometimes we are just pathetic.     Like sometimes life gets too much.     Yeah.     Yeah.     Yeah.     Your life gets too much.     You just want to hug your wife or your partner or whatever.     Yeah.     Or have a cry.     Yeah.     Yeah.     Yeah.     And we're not allowed to feel that.     But, and like society will insult us for that.     Yeah.     Society will even insult us for like, I remember being called gay for liking a girl.     Like society will, when you're a kid, being a guy.     Which isn't even a pejorative.     Yeah.     Yeah.     Well, it's insane that that doesn't logically.     Yeah.     Yeah.     It used to be back in the day.     But just the logic of that expression doesn't make sense.     Yeah.     Yeah.     So, yeah, it's like you, gay would have meant that you showed any sign of feelings.     Yeah.     It was like this word.     Any feminine energy.     Yeah.     Yeah.     Any sign.     Don't you think the most.     Yeah.     And that probably is true to an extent.     And I remember experiencing that growing up in the 90s, early 2000s, that the idea of being homosexual was literally the worst thing you could be.     And we have moved on massively.     And that's great.     That's wokeness.     But the truth that I experienced was that, because I've got three sisters, I've got two older sisters and a younger sister.     And I think I was made immune to this because I was surrounded by my mother.     And three sisters.     And was somewhat humbled by that, that women have very different expectations.     And I was the black sheep of the family.     I was very different.     But I think I benefited from the fact that actually, like, women are just taught to be more empathetic, to care more, to communicate, to be open with how they feel.     And I got best of both, where I'm an autistic individual who likes stuff.     I like things.     I like my own time.     I'm a loner.     But also made to interact and communicate.     But more than ever, young men aren't doing that.     Young men are lonely.     They don't have friends.     They stay in.     They play the computer games.     Yeah, they may play computer games online and have that interaction.     But are they talking about how they feel?     How they make feel scared?     Because imagine a 14, 13-year-old boy expressing fear for the future.     Fear by not being liked by someone.     It ain't happening.     And that's genuinely depressing to me.     Not that I was, you know, expressing my feelings as a teenager.     I think most people don't.     I think that's kind of the point of being a teenager.     You're unable to.     At that point, you're not mature.     But we've got a long way to go.     Let's just say.     And it's good that we're having these conversations.     But it just shows you how back, even in the 90s, like the idea of a young man expressing himself in something other than anger.     And even people now don't like men being angry.     You can't even be angry as a man now.     I thought that was a valid emotion.     I thought all emotions are valid.     But I think they are.     I think anger is a very valid emotion.     But how do you use it?     And I think that's how emotions, because we don't talk about emotions.     Like, what is an emotion?     It's a very nebulous thing.     It's a very slippery thing.     Like, are you happy?     Are you sad?     Like, sometimes you're both.     You don't know.     We don't necessarily have the language or means to go, actually, I don't know.     Sometimes anger can be masquerading sadness all the other way around.     But often, young boys, especially in school, aren't allowed to express these feelings.     Like, there's so much data that says young boys are just assumed, if there's a fight between a boy and a girl, it's assumed that the boy was the aggressor.     It's assumed that boys are the naughty ones.     And they'll get punished more.     Even though the girl could have done something wrong.     Why?     And it all comes back to gender, essentially.     Like, gender expectations are so, I don't like the term per se, but toxic towards men and women.     Because we have these pre-written scripts of what it means to be a man and what it means to be a woman.     And you have to adhere to this.     And if you don't, it's like you will be shamed as a young man.     Like, oh, you're gay because you're talking to women.     Or you're not, you know, playing by the rules.     You're doing well in class.     That's a big one for working class communities.     I grew up like that.     Like, doing well in school was considered a bad thing.     Getting on, doing your studies, listening to the teacher was considered a bad thing.     And I think we've moved on from that.     But we've still got a long way to go.     That was a long ramble.     The most, like, crazy gaslighting smokescreen of all is that women are packaged up as being emotional.     But the one emotion that men are allowed to have is anger.     Anger is all we're allowed.     Which is massively emotional.     And we're rewarded for it.     Well, anger is emotion.     But I think men, in my anecdotal experience, men are way more emotional than women.     Women may get emotional on a period, may, you know, have a few days that are difficult.     But I think overall, in my experience, men, because they can't articulate their emotions, and they've not been brought up to, and they're not expected to, often it just comes out in anger or a way that's not healthy.     Alcoholism, addiction, computer games, self-hatred, porn addiction.     All these things that are not good for men.     And they're silent, and they suffer in silence.     Men, so many men suffer in silence.     Because often their men's issues are just like, it's a joke.     Oh, man's depressed.     So, suck it up.     Okay.     Should he do that?     I don't think so.     But that's what we're taught to do.     And it's not healthy.     It's exhausting.     And we're rewarded for it.     So, like, say in school, I don't know.     I remember, literally, if, like, you and your mate were hanging out too much, you'd get called gay.     And so that just tells a young lad that you're being rejected from the group.     But I remember, if I get in a fight and I win that fight, I'm the coolest kid in the playground for, like, at least a week.     Yeah.     And it was like, that has a massive impact when you grow up.     You're like, the only emotion that I'm allowed to express is anger.     Yeah.     And, yeah, and I think, like, and so we do, like, you know, Jordan Pearson, he talks in this emotive way.     So, that's why a lot of people that follow him are like, he's not far right, he's not alt-right or whatever, because he's emotional and shit.     And he cries all the time.     It is this interesting dichotomy of, like, yeah.     But then how do you square that with Andrew Tate, who has not got that emotional sight of it?     Well, he is emotional.     Very shouty.     Very shouty.     Very angry.     Very premenstrual.     I don't want to even describe him as alpha male, because he is premenstrual.     Yeah, yeah.     Because that is not an alpha male.     That is such, in my eyes, he's a very broken, weak, tragic person.     Yeah, 100%.     And yet something is happening where he is also being regarded as this kind of, I don't know, is it a show of strength?     But it's like, this is that thing of within the world that we live in, he is and the culture and the way that capitalism works is he is rewarded.     By being so deeply ruthless, society is rewarded.     He's made a load of money.     And that is the system we live in, is that... Patriarchy.     Yeah.     And it's just capitalism as well.     It's like, it's just the fact that you get a financial reward.     You get all the things.     You get the woman.     You get the car.     You get the... All the things that society tells you is important.     You get that by being the worst possible type of person.     He is like within the framework that this is like that sort of neoliberal attitude, that sort of Thatcher... Trump.     Yeah.     But like that Thatcher attitude of there's no alternative.     Capitalism is everything.     And he won.     And so young lads are looking at him and they're like, well, he's got money.     He's got all the things that I'm told I should have to be happy.     And yeah, in that world where really, I think really, really deeply in all these young lads' hearts is they just want to be loved.     And they just want to have a life where they work hard and they'll be rewarded for it.     And maybe they get a house and maybe they can have a family.     Maybe they can have kids.     That's all at the end of the day.     I really think our needs are so little.     But in a society where that is fucking stripped from us, like the idea of having a house is like insane for most average people.     And so then you're just like in this world where you're hopeless.     And then someone like him is like this ruthless character.     And that's the world that we're being told to adapt to.     So it's almost logical in a sense.     Like there's almost some logic to it in a fucked up way.     Yeah, Jimmy the Giant is right.     In the logic of capitalism, Andrew Tate is inevitable with the success of Donald Trump, that dog eat dog, the art of the deal, be a successful businessman.     And it can be facade as well.     People enjoy facade.     People enjoy the fact that Donald Trump was on The Apprentice.     This idea that you're fired.     I'm in control.     I'm strong.     People love it.     And you can't underestimate that.     People go, oh, yeah, we know it's shallow.     We know.     But we've got to engage with that and be popular and be entertaining.     We live in an era of populism.     And there's many flaws to populism.     But that's what we've got.     And the left are really not good at really tapping into simple narratives.     Because we see things as massively complex.     They are gender dynamics.     Alternatives to capitalism.     The idea that people really are convinced.     Like, imagine having a conversation with someone and trying to convince them that gravity doesn't exist.     That there's no alternative to gravity.     You wouldn't be able to do it because capitalism is so naturalized in our minds that it's just inevitable.     It's like, yeah, it'd be nice to have a theory system.     But this is the best we've got.     And we've got to deal with it.     And, you know, we've got to cut spending.     It doesn't have to be this way.     We decide what we emphasize and what we prioritize.     Do we prioritize well-being of the majority?     Or a small minority who have all the money?     That's the two choices we have.     And right now we're being convinced that the portfolio of 4,000 people on this planet is more important than 8 billion people.     Insane.     But I think people are pushing back.     I think people are realizing Trump is a fraud.     But Elon Musk doesn't care about you.     And the left need to be there and go, yes, there is an alternative.     But it means the billionaires paying more.     It means people need more control in the workplace.     People need to have democratic accountability.     We need a better press.     We need a press that holds the elites to account.     There's a lot of work to do.     So hit the like button and I'll see you in the next video.	1. @AntonyJones(2025-04-13 07:08:58) Is JimmyTheGiant right about Andrew Tate? 2. @cujimmi(2025-04-13 07:16:01) Capitalism works .. socialism does not 3. @softhaus4485(2025-04-13 07:27:58) 5:35 I feel like most people, in this case boys who listen to andrew tate, only experience the male side of the problem and therefor get the idea that society is heavily favoured for women. But when you see the whole picture you can understand that society struggles to cater to both men and women but in very different ways. 4. @baobo67(2025-04-13 07:29:14) I take it the gesticulator pushing Nike is The Jimmy The Giant and I quickly discovered that he to was a talk circuit pontificater just like those he is airing off about. So much of the same old same old tossing around growing up problems and how screwed up people are who didn't. Thanks Antony. Cheers 5. @pleegjepleegje(2025-04-13 09:51:15) I think that our current competitive system makes us miserable because it's against human nature. I grew up in a coastal town on a peninsula, and when I got to choose a sport I chose the swimming club that trained the lifeguards. There was no separation of boys and girls, and there was no emphasis on competition. We learned to cooperate instead and built our skills to get drowning people out of the water. We worked out for physical strength and endurance, not for looks or medals. I refuse to believe that competition is necessary to achieve great things. I believe that cooperation, empathy, compassion, and equality bring us way further and make us happy instead of anxious and lonely. I'm done with capitalism and patriarchy. 6. @hanzo7616(2025-04-13 10:35:26) It's simple. Competitiveness IS human nature, but there is a BASELINE where you want society to be WELL. If there isn't, then that contradicts the 'self-help' advice of Taint's message. It means the very idea of Taint wanting to help people is a fraud (& I believe for him, thats true). 7. @camo68(2025-04-13 11:18:35) Incoherent Nonsensical Left wing dribble. Men???????????????? The left don't know anything about men???????? Trans are men and you call them women, so how is it possible you understand real men??? Nonsense 8. @scooble(2025-04-13 12:31:46) Accelerating wealth inequality combined with rugged individualism in a zero sum game framework is a toxic combo 9. @DeusEx-o1y(2025-04-13 13:45:00) Can relate to your upbringing with having sisters, plus a few of the other things you said. That may have helped me see that gender is kind of made up. I think it's the same way that if you believe there is something dangerous in the bushes, you feel the anxiety even if nothing is there. Same with the concepts of gender. Seeing them as arbitrary, the feelings can just fall away. That's sort of the message I think would be best for young men, or everyone really. 10. @JimmyTheGiant(2025-04-13 13:56:25) great thoughts bro - gonna give that book a read. 11. @StratsRUs(2025-04-13 14:19:38) ME = Monetise Everything 12. @theglorioushardlardbig-esm8538(2025-04-13 14:24:30) I'm going to be honest with you a lot of people don't talk about men's issues because they aren't complicated it's literally because groups don't want to talk about it cuz they feel like they'll be alienating there base if they do so Re-edited because he deleted my response: (So are we just going to pretend that when Brianna Wu brought up men's suicide and loneliness that there weren't legions of feminists on Twitter and Instagram and Facebook saying that these lonely) entitled predators don't deserve anything 13. @yorkiesart(2025-04-13 14:48:00) Andrew Tate and his brother are what a,man looks like to a prepubescent boy. If you forgive him his violent , disgusting misogyny and his ' you are the victim ' BS, because he suggests going to the gym etc. Is like saying......i know that Hitler caused the death's of millions of innocent people, but he built the autobahns and painted some nice watercolours. Andrew and Tristan Tate are disgusting, embarrassments to any man who understands true strength and true principles. 14. @anthill1510(2025-04-13 14:59:55) Men are victims of the same system that women are. The reason more men unalive themselves is the same reason why so many women are victims of DV by men. It`s the lack of emotional skills, the sense of entitlement and the violence that is taught to men that either backfires on themselves or is taken out on others. It`s not two problems pitched against each other, it`s the same thing. 15. @jim-es8qk(2025-04-13 15:30:57) The death of the family. Having a decent family is like a super power, they back you up, they bail you out, and give you direction. Without a dad or a father figure, boys are lost. 16. @MissDanah(2025-04-13 17:07:06) It’s a great point about environment being so powerful. I believe in the genetic differences, but you’re so right. Tough times now hey? So much more complicated xx 17. @shanewyatt9939(2025-04-13 18:22:19) I seen Tate say the other day that as a man if your not rich then your love means nothing to your family... That is such an insidious thing to say to young men, really made me change my mind about him as I do agree with a good amount of what he says (certainly not all) but to try and use a man's love for his family against him in order to sell his bullshit course is low 18. @tiphmiller_sacred_ink(2025-04-13 19:40:35) Gay 19. @WildRandysWorld(2025-04-13 21:30:35) jimmythegiantplant reeks of a government plant 20. @ctrash(2025-04-14 00:12:50) Andrew isnt winning... getting away with things and not being punished isnt winning. He's not thriving. He has no market, no motion, and is largely a nobody. Being known because youre controversial is not the same as being known because you're liked. He's a loser, he's just exploitative and has no empathy. In the long game, he will lose. Right now he's just existing.The victors write the history books and he's illiterate. 21. @user-gc2wt3dx7q(2025-04-14 10:38:04) Why the Nike sweatshop product endorsement? 22. @ebubechiibegbula5968(2025-04-14 10:56:17) A mans real best friend is almost always a woman usually his wife ... Women on the other hand have a best friend for every scenario life throws at them and only one maybe a man... 23. @PeoplePleaser578(2025-04-14 13:17:22) Academic they might have that conversation, publicly and in the media… not so much. It’s only really in the last couple of years that we’ve started to see men’s mental health groups actually come up (Like Andy’s Men’s Club). 24. @solomonv2497(2025-04-14 14:34:44) We control human nature, at every level. Man is infinitely malleable. 25. @jbeep33(2025-04-14 16:55:19) if you live in LaLa land you will fail at real life. it's pretty simple really. stop resisting like a child and grow 26. @camo68(2025-04-14 17:23:32) HMMMM Black sheep of the family . Interesting. I think that has racist connotations. Not a psychological expert but Freudian slip comes to mind. Must be hard on the left being so pure you're ignorant to your own shortcomings. Very interesting indeed. I nearly missed it ???????????? 27. @infertilepiggy5667(2025-04-14 18:34:44) Almost like alot disparaging men for 60years would lead them to not care about women in general But what would i know, im just a privileged straight white english male You know those people that get blamed for the worlds problems Were just tored of talking amd no one listening then assuming everything we are and believe Deal with shit yourselves, im not going to war for you 28. @HebiNoMe(2025-04-16 09:04:21) Yeah, neuroplasticity... Men and women are biologically different because of the environment that shaped our brains and continues to shape our brains. The nature vs nurture debate are two sides of the same coin. A feedback loop. 29. @eddiejames4730(2025-04-16 09:09:32) I think Andrew tate’s point is that that Why doesn’t matter.. simply make the best move you can make on the current chess board… its tough and unfair but sitting around analysing that will make you loose to someone who redirects that energy into solution. Thoughts?